On the EDge: Hysterical theocracy makes one more stab at MMJ prohibition

Composite image | Photo of LDS church courtesy of AndreyKrav and medical marijuana overlay courtesy of ChrisGorgio, iStock / Getty Images Plus, St. George News

OPINION – I get it, Utah, you hate California.

You hate California so much that you will do everything within your power to ensure that the customs, lifestyle and influences of the Golden State do not contaminate the purity of your beloved Beehive State.

Never mind that there are many former Californians who cashed out when the housing market was booming and plunked down their money on new homes in Southern Utah.

Never mind that there are large pockets of ultra-conservatives in California, particularly the southern part of the state where the locals equate liberalism to a felony or, at the very least, an intellectual malfunction.

None of that matters if even a hint of California influence wafts over the border, which is, perhaps, why a group opposed to a measure that would allow compassionate use of cannabis in Utah is going to such fallacious lengths to try to quash the initiative, including a newly filed lawsuit asking for an emergency injunction to block the measure from the ballot.

The claims are stunningly and purposely inaccurate, as the Libertas Institute noted in a point-by-point rebuttal to the lawsuit. The filing was based on a legal analysis bought and paid for by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and prepared by the law firm of Kirton McConkie. The firm represents the church and has such a close relationship that it occupies offices across the street from the church’s Administration Building. It is safe to say the firm is a surrogate for the church in this matter.

The papers were filed in behalf of the Coalition for a Safe and Healthy Utah, which has also been known as Drug Safe Utah. The group is comprised of the Utah Medical Association, Utah Eagle Forum, Sutherland Institute, Utah Prevention Coalition Association, various behavioral health groups, Utah Narcotics Officers Association, Utah Chiefs of Police and other law enforcement groups and “concerned citizens.” Although not acknowledged publicly, the LDS church falls into the latter of those groups.

The church has come out swinging just about as hard on this issue as it did on LGBTQ rights and gay marriage.

The impact of the church on its LGBTQ community has been devastating. It has historically employed cruel and unforgiving tactics, ranging from shunning and total rejection to forcing what is known as conversion therapy upon LGBTQ members, including the belief that you could “pray away the gay.”

Perhaps church officials will institute a “pray away the MMJ” program to make this whole medicinal cannabis thing disappear. It won’t happen because the reality is more people would be comfortable with legalized medicinal cannabis than legalized gay marriage.

Look, I have no problem with whichever faith you embrace, just do so in your house of worship and not on my doorstep or in a city, county, state or federal government office.

The church has neither scientific nor practical experience with cannabis, yet it insists on inflicting its demands on our elected officials and the public at large.

The comforting news is that at some time – sooner than later – this will all go away because voters will side with science about the palliative properties of cannabis as both a medicinal and recreational alternative that better serves the public than alcohol, tobacco or any other illicit substance.

It will no longer be a matter of a church dangling salvation as the influencing factor because voters seem poised to sweep the measure into law by a landslide. According to recent polls, 77 percent of Utahns support the measure, meaning it should easily pass here in November.

As far as cannabis legalization is concerned, the Utah measure is Pot Light.

You won’t be allowed to cultivate your own cannabis and you won’t be allowed to smoke it.

There is, apparently, concern about the number of Utahns that may qualify for a medical cannabis prescription.

I will take what the church and Coalition for a Safe and Healthy Utah, Drug Safe Utah or whatever the puppets at Kirton McConkie say seriously when they express equal concern about the number of Utahns who already qualify for an opioid prescription or a Xanax, Valium or Ativan prescription.

I will believe the Utah Medical Association, Utah Eagle Forum, Sutherland Institute, Utah Prevention Coalition Association, various behavioral health groups, Utah Narcotics Officers Association, Utah Chiefs of Police and other law enforcement groups and “concerned citizens” have our best interests at heart when they speak for themselves and do not parrot the official remarks attributed to church authorities.

I will get off the backs of our legislators when they reflect the will of the people instead of bowing to a theocracy.

And, I will give some genuine cred to the church, the Legislature and voters when they realize that, well, not everything coming from California is bad.

I have had my problems with the state over the years.

There was the little matter of Gov. Ronald Reagan.

There was a matter of the riots – from the Watts riots to the so-called Rodney King Riots.

There’s this plastic façade with little substance, depth or intellect that infects so many and has earned Los Angeles, rightfully so, in some respects, the pseudonym of La-La Land.

Then, there are all those nasty earthquakes.

But, there’s the California economy – fifth-largest in the world that just last month added 39,300 new jobs with a record-low unemployment of 4.2 percent.

There’s the weather, of course, and scenic beauty that compares with anywhere, including Utah. Don’t believe me? Go explore the Eastern Sierras. Pines are every bit as beautiful as red rock.

And, even though California Democrats outnumber Republicans 44 percent to 29 percent, the state is not the poster child for liberalism some would lead you to believe. Just ask Diane Feinstein or Nancy Pelosi, who are not necessarily shoo-ins any longer.

But, California does have a progressive trajectory among its Democrats and Republicans that intersected in 1996 when it voted to legalize cannabis for medicinal purposes and, again, last year, legalizing it for recreational use.

And, guess what?

The world didn’t end.

Utah will be just fine, thank you, with legalized medicinal cannabis no matter what the hysterical theocracy says.

And, we can all thank California for leading the way.

Ed Kociela is an opinion columnist. The opinions stated in this article are his and not representative of St. George News.

Email: [email protected]

Twitter: @STGnews, @EdKociela

Copyright St. George News, StGeorgeUtah.com Inc., 2018, all rights reserved.

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  • tcrider May 22, 2018 at 3:56 pm

    good article Ed,
    I thought the law suit was technically about enabling write-ins for the ballot,
    the self righteous will put what ever label they can dream of to try and control
    the sheep.
    And what ever happened to the first amendment? what about separation church and state, or
    is it a pick and choose whatever amendment you choose to support?

  • No Filter May 22, 2018 at 3:57 pm

    If southern Utah is so against marijuana, then why is the dispensary always filled with Utah plates in Mesquite. I believe this is a just few last ditch efforts to stop the vote by the church in hopes to keep control of the ever shrinking LDS church members who are against Medical Marijuana and anything else that loses the church money.

  • NickDanger May 22, 2018 at 5:54 pm

    Never thought I’d say this, but I agree with Ed.

  • Carpe Diem May 22, 2018 at 6:24 pm

    In 20 or so years, my favorite article by Ed Kociela. Nail on the head. It’s coming down the road and LDS are going to be all in w/in ten years. Pot will be legal Federally before long anyway as Big Pharma becomes exposed and loses the battle.

    • Utahguns May 22, 2018 at 7:21 pm

      I’m agreeing with Ed?
      That’s worth a beer there fella……

      • Carpe Diem May 22, 2018 at 9:32 pm

        You got that right! Sampling a Squatters Double IPA. Cheers to Ed!

  • John May 22, 2018 at 6:27 pm

    Go smoke another one eddie!..

    • No Filter May 22, 2018 at 7:20 pm

      Don’t listen to lumpy! If your ever in town I’ll light one up with you Ed.

      • Carpe Diem May 22, 2018 at 9:35 pm

        Meet up on top of the “D rock” on April 20, 2020, at 4:20 pm?

      • Lee Saunders May 23, 2018 at 12:32 am

        Best to just totally ignore him. I wish I didn’t even have to remind folks.

        • John May 23, 2018 at 8:49 pm

          Lee, You missed a spot on that table, with performance like this you will never be promoted to fry salter. your’e a sad excuse for a fifty something libtard ! hahahahahahahahahaha!

    • Utahguns May 22, 2018 at 7:23 pm

      …With THC concentrations on the flower products going up past 15% – 20%, all it takes is a few tokes on the bowl.

      • jaybird May 23, 2018 at 8:47 pm

        Or CBD tincture tends to clear up pain BETTER than Aleve. Medicinal cannabis comes in many forms now. You don’t have to smoke it like some of these idiots seem to think.

  • dogmatic May 22, 2018 at 7:19 pm

    I got no problem with MMJ just like to 70% of Utahans you claim in this article, I don’t have a need for it just like 95% of Utahans. But California, the porn capital of the world and has 6 of the 10 most polluted cities in the US not to mention a rising crime rate is not what I respect as a moral authority on this issue.
    I hold my allegiance to a higher authority. Amen ?

  • Real Life May 22, 2018 at 8:59 pm

    Ed nailed this one.

  • jaltair May 22, 2018 at 9:00 pm

    Ed Kociela, I don’t always agree with you; however, on this one I do!

    MMJ would help so many who suffer from long-term illness or those with a terminal illness. How I’ve wished MMJ would be legal in UT. I am 71, and I have lupus, fibromyalgia, kidney disease, and arthritis – all these conditions create so much pain and I’m on pain relievers and other meds to alleviate the discomforts (non-opioid). I would like the MMJ instead of the other chemicals I have to take to keep the pain at bay. I’ve talked with many who use MMJ in different areas of our western states and they have been helped greatly.

    I wonder why the LDS church feels they have to lobby government for moral measures? This does seem to go against our Constitutional rights. I remember when CA was debating the issue of LGBT right to marry. The LDS church (Salt Lake) gave a humongous amount of money to lobby against it happening. This was even an issue in UT at the time. People have the right to choose how to live their lives and I thought LDS belief on that was along those lines. I’m a libertarian/independent, and that may explain my stand on these issues.

    I’m not a bad person, just a regular and normal person who would like to have MMJ to help me with my pain and discomfort.

    • Carpe Diem May 22, 2018 at 9:40 pm

      As an outside observer, I’ve seen the LDS religion errr leadership exhibit bouts of dysfunction.

      Too many to mention but I’ll wager everyone here, even members, know what I’m talking about.

      • comments May 22, 2018 at 10:58 pm

        As an LDS member since 8yrs old I can say that dysfunction comes naturally to them. But so long as the money is rolling in all is well.

    • jaybird May 23, 2018 at 8:48 pm

      I’m with you, jaltair

  • thejoshw May 22, 2018 at 10:11 pm

    One day…just one day I would love to see a Utah that separates church from state. I think everyone would be happier.

    • uprightandmovingforward May 23, 2018 at 7:23 am

      If you don’t like it, go back to where you came from. No one is forcing you to stay here. It is unbelievable that one can’t see that the church’s influence has made Utah a nice place to live, not the other way around. I’m sure you will enjoy Detroit, the murder capital of the world, please move there why don’t you?

      • An actual Independent May 23, 2018 at 10:45 am

        With all the move-ins that the local good ol’ boys have been encouraging, it won’t be too long before the newcomers will be the majority. Then they can tell you “If you don’t like it here ANYMORE, you can leave.” We won’t force you to stay.

      • No Filter May 23, 2018 at 11:07 am

        The church only makes Utah a nice place to live if you are in their cult. The rest of us normal people have to deal with their stories of false prophets and floating orbs. Planets named kolob and really bad living scripture cartoons. People move here for the beauty of the red sand and wonderful weather, not the religion. Many are christian and many are not, but I can guarantee that your type of cult like beliefs will eventually die out and allow the LDS religion to thrive without your ridiculous old fashioned beliefs. I believe the LDS church can be a very great religion if they just shred their crazy cult ideals. Most LDS people I have met are really great people, but loons like you ruin it for them with your resistance to progress. Progress stops for no one, including myself.

      • thejoshw May 23, 2018 at 12:08 pm

        Dear “uprightandmovingforward”,

        Thanks for your reply to my comment. If you must know, I am actually “back to where [I] came from”. I was born in Utah. I have lived in 6 other states in my short 33 years of life. And I enjoy living here. I realize no one is forcing me to stay, and I am here on my own free will.

        I would agree with you that the church has influenced the state to a certain desirable degree… however, I would challenge you to prove to me how the church and the state are separate entity’s. Considering the majority of our elected officials are in fact Mormon, it would be hard for me (again, a native Utahn) to believe that they are enacting laws that do not meet their personal and religious ideals, than those of the state they “represent”. The voices of us minority voters hardly carry the same weight as those who agree with the church’s tenets.

        And as far as your wish for me (presumably my family), to get murdered in Detroit…. I’ll do the Christ-like thing and just turn the other cheek.

      • mctrialsguy May 23, 2018 at 5:20 pm

        Ed has smoked to many doobies…California is a now cesspool (used to be a great religious state at one time) and the reason that I left there is the drugs, graffiti, 11 Million Illegal Mexicans dumping their couches, refrigerators, stoves and furniture wherever they wish at night, car accidents that are hit and runs because of the illegals that don’t have insurance and their DUI’s, and did I say drugs??!! The liberal state is going broke (Ed will differ on this one) and there are 28 taxes to support the Hispanic’s medical, law suits, freebies, etc..!!! Religion in Utah (and no, I am not Mormon) created a utopia of people that had values and practiced them, sure all changes in time, but if you accept California’s living style and trends, Utah will be a cesspool in 20 years…guaranteed!

        • jaybird May 23, 2018 at 8:51 pm

          Yes, such values as getting people hooked on opiods as a top 10 state, marrying their young off to old men. Trust me except for the views, Utah is no utopia. PS: California is not going broke and you can actually make a living there, unlike here.

        • uprightandmovingforward May 24, 2018 at 6:58 am


  • Lee Saunders May 23, 2018 at 12:44 am

    Ed, as you alluded, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if big pharma is a major pusher in this opposition. It’s not just the anti-depressants, but many other disorders can be treated with medical marijuana such as epilepsy, sleep disorders and chronic fatigue, to mention a couple. You also mentioned the success California has had with the program and not to forget the many millions of tax revenue and jobs generated in states such as Colorado where they’re experiencing a very successful program with minimal problems. Great article, with some unusually intelligent comments-with one exception…

  • Craig May 23, 2018 at 7:10 am

    Why are the Utah Medical Association and the Police Chiefs against legalization?

    Certainly, not everyone against it is in some joint conspiracy.

    • John May 23, 2018 at 10:51 am

      Because most people “In the know” understand that it’s the potheads looking for an excuse to make their illegal, damaging and foolish behavior not a crime. And for that reason, the medical benefits do not outweigh the damage legalization will do to society. It will NEVER pass in Utah!

      • No Filter May 23, 2018 at 1:31 pm

        Do you think putting “never” in all caps makes it stronger? If 70% of a state wants something, then the voters will win because 70 is greater than 30, that is basic math and I know its s new concept for you so take it in slowly. 70>30

        • Lee Saunders May 23, 2018 at 2:15 pm

          Ignore him.

          • John May 23, 2018 at 3:01 pm

            Go clean some more tables Lee!..

        • John May 23, 2018 at 3:00 pm

          it is what it is cloggy..hahahaha! you clueless minor1

          • No Filter May 23, 2018 at 4:10 pm


          • John May 23, 2018 at 7:26 pm

            yes child..go change your diaper..it’s clogged again..hahahahahahaha!

          • jaybird May 23, 2018 at 8:52 pm

            Forget this toilet. His comments always a meant to hurt and maim.

          • John May 23, 2018 at 9:34 pm

            dodo bird lays another libtard egg! hahahahahahahahha!

  • uprightandmovingforward May 23, 2018 at 7:15 am

    If California is so Great, why don’t you all just stay there! No one asked you to come to Utah. You came here because life in California sucks with all the druggies , the traffic, the high taxes, poor government services and pollution. You came to Utah because it is a nicer place to live and now you want to change it into another crappy California. It just doesn’t make sense to want to change Utah into the California that you left. Why wouldn’t you want to adopt the way of life that made Utah a nice place to live instead of changing it into the crappy world you left? As Mark Twain said, “Insanity is making the same decisions over and over again and expecting different results.” You are insane to think adopting the California lifestyle here will lead to better result than California’s current condition. If you like California so much, GO BACK and don’t try and destroy the wonderful way of life we have created here.

    • mctrialsguy May 23, 2018 at 5:21 pm

      Thank you!! So true.

    • jaybird May 23, 2018 at 8:56 pm

      It’s a good thing Californians come here. They are the only ones who can afford this place. We Utahns live off the Californians wages.

  • uprightandmovingforward May 23, 2018 at 7:20 am

    St George News PLEASE stop publishing Ed Kociela’s articles. He is an idiot and does nothing but disrespect those who built such a nice place to live. He is a voice of corruption that will lead to undermining the pleasant way of life here that we all came here to enjoy.

    • theone May 23, 2018 at 9:35 am


      You are the perfect example of why we need more California residents moving to our great state. With the level of anti everything you display it’s a wonder you even care about fellow humans that would benefit from medicinal properties of MMJ. Your tiny worldview is becoming a lost cause and we’ll see you in the new progressive future whether you like it or not.

    • John May 23, 2018 at 10:55 am

      agreed.. ed is a liberal pothead..types in crayon and gets frito crumbs all over whatever he touches. At all costs he always avoids FACTS because the use of facts might make him look stupid, but he does a good enough job being so far left he fell off the table years ago !

      • No Filter May 23, 2018 at 11:21 am

        Lumpy I don’t think you completely understand the definition of the word “fact”. I can tell you for sure it’s not defined as any word that comes from Sean Hannity or Donald Trump. Just so you learn something today here is the definition of the word “fact”: something that actually exists; reality; truth. if you want I can find a picture book to help you if words are to hard for you.


        • John May 23, 2018 at 1:07 pm

          oh? I do cloggy. Go smoke another bong hit and choke on it loser ! I don’t have the time or the crayons to explain it to your childlike mentality. “Something that exists” Try it sometime and get off your imaginary unicorn .. A clogged filter is a useless filter. Here’s fact for you….You continually prove your cluelessness..hahahahahahahahahahaha!

          • No Filter May 23, 2018 at 2:55 pm

            Well first off, I don’t use a bong, I like to roll my joints. Second it has been months since I first asked for a real answer to your clueless comment and still nothing. I am starting to think you don’t know the meaning of that word either. Maybe you should ride the bus down to the library and read a little. It’s free and I bet you can have a librarian help you with the big words.

          • John May 23, 2018 at 7:29 pm

            I don’t have to answer your clueless question, you do such a fine job of proving that you are clueless Just by your inane factless libtard comments. I throw away clogged filters and laugh at uninformed clueless morons..hahahahahahahahahaha! And a bong is probably too technical for you anyway..

        • Lee Saunders May 23, 2018 at 2:17 pm

          Ignore him.

          • No Filter May 23, 2018 at 2:57 pm

            Thanks for the advice, but I like getting Lumpy (John) all worked up. I take no offense to him, I just enjoy trolling him. Its like the feeling you get when you pretend to throw a ball and the dog still chases after it. Good times!

        • John May 23, 2018 at 3:10 pm

          cloggy, I know, The simple minded like you are so easy to entertain..clueless as always, uninformed and a never ending need for attention, just like a typical 1st grader! Did you drop your binky again?

          • John May 23, 2018 at 8:36 pm

            I get the same thrill trolling you as I get when I arrest a moronic clogged pothead. Just hope I’m not the one that pulls you over on your way back from mesquite ! hahahahahahahahahahaha!

          • No Filter May 23, 2018 at 9:18 pm

            You are dreaming now, what law enforcement would hire you? You don’t have a high enough education to be a security guard at Walmart. I know the sheriff deputies in town and most of the police in St. George and trust me you would stick out in a crowd. So your lying for sure! Keep making up stories Lumpy.

          • John May 23, 2018 at 10:33 pm

            I guess you will never know…hahahahahahahahahahaha! better watch your back cloggy !

    • No Filter May 23, 2018 at 11:13 am

      Not going to happen uptight, whether you agree with Ed or not, I bet he brings in more ad revenue than any other author on the website. Here is a thought, maybe stop reading his articles, they only come once a week. Keep watching Fox news and the Mormon channel and leave the STGnews to the normal people of Washington County.

      • mctrialsguy May 23, 2018 at 5:24 pm

        You sir are a good example of what pot smoking does to you, you get the munchies and watch CNN, and then…your brain is gone….gone…gone.

        • John May 23, 2018 at 7:32 pm

          Mostly crap clogging that filter too ! Probably the single most ignorant clueless commenter on all of St George News. I’ll bet she has an altar set up to worship rachel madcow, the savior of the leftard movement !

          • jaybird May 23, 2018 at 8:58 pm

            You should know about crap clogs, “john”.

          • John May 23, 2018 at 9:39 pm

            It’s so much fun making cloggy cry. As for you dodo-bird, you are just a brain damaged pothead whose parents were first cousins.

  • semantics? May 23, 2018 at 10:36 am

    Call me crazy, but if you are going to criticize a position, as a journalist, shouldn’t you at least indicate what the concerns being raised include. Sorry, the Constitutional prohibition regarding separation of church and state never indicated that a theological opinion have influence in the public square, rather it mandates that the state cannot force or create a state church.

    If any of you are interested: here is an Op-ed by Rick Larsen about the debate from Sutherland Institute. Be informed and make a rational choice, whatever that is. You will recall that our founding fathers indicated that our republic only works with an informed citizenry. We need to be informed first and then have a debate.

    Published on May 21, 2018

    Originally published by Utah Policy.

    When accidents occur in auto racing, spectators get so caught up in the carnage and the speed at which it all happens that they have little time to consider what might have set the whole thing in motion. Was it something that happened in the heat of competition? Or was there an unsportsmanlike nudge that sent the cars careening?

    The medical marijuana ballot initiative has come to resemble a NASCAR pileup. It’s time to take a deep breath and think carefully about where we go next. Let’s wave a yellow flag and signal a slowdown based on potential dangers ahead.

    After previous legislative attempts to expand legal access to marijuana, the Utah Patients Coalition decided the legislative approach was taking too long for people suffering from chronic pain. As constitutionally allowed, they decided to take the issue to the people by gathering signatures to get the matter on the ballot.

    So far, everyone seemed to be staying in their lanes. Some concerned groups – Sutherland Institute among them – had questions as to whether people had actually read the petition, or were responding to brief explanations and signing in favor of a very complicated issue (an inherent risk of the ballot initiative process). For others in Utah, red flags in this initiative include overly broad language that could lead to unintended and even perilous consequences. This is where the nudging began. Claims and counterclaims are crashing; visibility has declined amid the smoke; and all parties are accusing someone of not following the rules.

    Ever since – like stock cars helplessly zigzagging at high speed into a tangle of other out-of-control vehicles – momentum has seemingly committed all parties to a full-throttle, pedal-to-the-metal path, each hoping their car will emerge on the other side, still capable of finishing the race.

    But the reality is, we are not on a track nor in a race, and there is no predetermined outcome. This is a debate – a decision to be made – over important policy that will impact Utah for generations to come. There is so much at stake.

    Patients are suffering. Doctors are concerned. Compliance with federal law is an issue. Lessons from other communities are cautionary. Community standards are at stake. And last but certainly not least, the integrity of the ballot initiative process,and our trust in one another, are all on the line.

    How can we navigate this yellow-flag moment and safely emerge on the other side? How can we come back from the first “nudge” – regardless of who initiated the contact – and solve this problem?

    First, let’s take responsibility for our own driving. For anyone who signed the petition expecting to see it on the November ballot – read the initiative! You owe it to your neighbors who will live with this decision. If you still agree with it – all of it – then own your decision and vote in November, and let’s dispense with the vitriol.

    If the language raises questions, move beyond accusations and inaccuracies by becoming informed. An hour spent gathering facts will help. A few suggested search topics include: the difference between CBD and THC, whether CBD is already available, and whether outside groups are seeking to influence Utah’s decision. Look and see if you are aligned or opposed to the Marijuana Policy Project and decide for yourself where you stand.

    Finally, sort through the debris already littering the track when it comes to motives. You as the voter will need to make the call as to whether this effort is driven by morals, compassion or revenue.

    This debate, and those caught in the middle, deserve so much more than front-porch ambushes, social media character assassinations and, now, litigation. We can do better. We have the capacity – with some personal effort – to make an informed decision. It was the fear of our unwillingness to do this very thing that compelled Alexander Hamilton to warn us about populism – the direct voice of a majority – that could lead to anarchy. Hamilton’s warning was not a criticism of the character of the people; it was a caution against unchecked and uninformed passion. It was the recognition that people can be riled up – and signature gatherers, lawsuits, and false accusations tend to do just that.

    Along with a conversation about the ballot initiative process, or the appropriateness of threats and lawsuits, Sutherland suggests a conversation about civility: about our willingness to engage and discover for ourselves the facts of any given issue. Given that we will likely see more initiatives in the future, we would do well to gain a clear understanding of our critical and personal obligation in the process.

    Utah should commit to fair competition in the arena of sound ideas and principled solutions – rather than this high–speed, “bump and run” strategy that will only hurt those we intend to help and lead to more reckless driving down the road.

    • semantics? May 23, 2018 at 11:20 am

      Sorry, I missed a word in the first sentence. It should read “the Constitutional prohibition regarding separation of church and state never indicated that a theological opinion could not have influence in the public square, . . . “

    • Lee Saunders May 23, 2018 at 2:26 pm

      You are right about populism especially in this day and age. Look who it got us for a president. Or, more accurately, the electoral system got us. More folks voted against him than for him.

      • John May 23, 2018 at 3:02 pm

        spoken by a true clueless busboy! hahahahahaha!

      • John May 23, 2018 at 3:06 pm

        Lee, you should use that brain for something other than a THC storage tank. You are beginning to sound as clueless as cloggy.

      • John May 23, 2018 at 8:54 pm

        And he’s sitting in the White House and you are wiping greasy tables at McD’s, I sense a big liberal flaw in your logic busboy !

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